How to have that hard conversation
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Casey: [00:00:00] Are you in a situation right now where you need to lean into something that's hard as it relates to your relationships. Like maybe you are thinking about approaching a family member that you've barely talked to in a year due to a completely different relationship now because of COVID related disagreements or perhaps, you know, you need to connect with your partner about your needs not being met.
Casey: Or you're struggling and you're scared to ask for help because of a mental illness. And maybe you need to set an important boundary because you keep feeling taken advantage of relationships can sometimes feel hard. And if you're feeling that right now, this episode is for you. Welcome back to the purpose map podcast.
Casey: I'm Casey Berglund, your host, and the founder of worthy end. Well, [00:01:00] and I'll be honest, there's a part of me that didn't really want to record this specific episode in this topic. But then I decided like, how can I not, I feel like in my life personally and professionally. I am having many conversations. well, yeah, personally that are hard and also family members and clients are coming to me with, with questions about like how they move through.
Casey: Uncomfortable moments in relationships, relationships on the whole are difficult sometimes. And when we layer on the tensions associated with the, I guess, trauma that we've been living in over the last couple of years with the pandemic and, and all that has ensued because of that. I just know that these relational issues can feel even more challenging, even more difficult.[00:02:00]
Casey: So we're going to dig in and you know what I'm going to do the best I can to offer up some thoughts, some insights, some skills, honestly, some skills that might support you in being brave and practicing courage and having hard conversations in relationships. This is the first episode of the worthy and well loved series.
Casey: And we have. A few amazing things in store. definitely a guest conversation where we talk about attachment theory, a live coaching session. That's about like, do I stay or do I go? And a couple solo episodes by me including this one. So shall we get to it? Oh, relationships can feel hard, especially when you have maybe competing commitments or values that are at play, as it relates to relationships.
COVID has really, I think, illuminated differences in perspectives. And what I'm [00:03:00] noticing anyway, is this divisiveness that we see and experience in the world. And I often find myself wondering like, ha if, if people had more skills in conversations, and in leaning into discomfort, would we be able to meet each other and.
Casey: Work towards something that is more maybe loving and yeah. Rooted in love rather than in fear. And I genuinely asked that as a question. I don't know. I don't have all the answers that's for sure. and I think because of clients and friends and family members that are communicating with me about difficult situations that they're navigating, it feels really important to bring this topic into the light.
Casey: And I do have a few thoughts. And hard conversations are hard for me too, though. I do feel like I tend to lean into them and I find [00:04:00] having embodiment skills, skills to like be with uncomfortable sensations in my body really helped. Even though it sucks, you know, so we're going to give it a shot and I'd love to share with you a couple of thoughts on what might support you in having that hard conversation, wherever it is in your life that you might need it.
Casey: The first thing that I think could change the world is if we all learned how to practice compassion and. I think these things that I'm about to say they really are like applied to oneself first, like self compassion in particular, practicing compassion, particularly self compassion, I think is a really important part of helping you to navigate difficult conversations with others, [00:05:00] because it helps you stay kind of.
Casey: Within your own self. And that self-kindness, that self-compassion, I find does translate into accessing a level of compassion and kindness for others. Especially in these tense moments, self-compassion is needed as a skill and compassion for others. So what does that mean? Well, I believe that part of practicing self-compassion is acknowledging the discomfort and specifically the discomfort that you feel in your body.
Casey: I think the first part of. Practicing self-compassion is acknowledging like this as hard, or this is difficult, or this is uncomfortable. And so pausing to create some spaciousness to feel that discomfort in your body, I think is an [00:06:00] early step in practicing. Self-compassion the next part is recognizing that no matter what you're feeling and truly.
Casey: I just, I know how your psyche works. I know that you've had moments in your life where you're like, why am I so fucked up? Like it's only me. Does anyone else have these thoughts or feelings I can assure you? Yes, they do. If you're feeling something that's so uncomfortable. Someone else's too. And you've probably heard that before, but I truly mean it.
Casey: Common humanity is such an important part of self-compassion. And what that means is recognizing that whatever pain or discomfort or unmet need or issue that you're experiencing struggle that you're experiencing inside of your own self. It isn't just yours. It's a shared experience. If you can feel it, another human has the capacity to feel it too.[00:07:00]
Casey: So common humanity or knowing that you're not alone in whatever you're experiencing is an important part of self-compassion. And then the third part is choosing to be kind. What would it be like to treat yourself in that moment? Like you would a close friend or someone you dearly love. So I threw out a couple of examples at the start.
Casey: You know, maybe you're someone who is navigating really hard relational stuff because of COVID related disagreements. If this is true, you're probably feeling that you're probably feeling the discomfort, the tension, the contraction, some version of sensation inside of your own body. And. Probably there's a part of you that totally just wants to escape that sensation and that wishes it wasn't there.
Casey: And it wouldn't be a hard [00:08:00] conversation if there wasn't something hard to feel inside of yourself. Creating some spaciousness to feel that discomfort and noticing that in this context, and then knowing that you're not alone with it and truly you're not alone. pretty much everyone that I talk to has one strained relationship at least, or more because of COVID related disagreements, you know?
Casey: So you're definitely not alone. What is the kind thing that you could do for yourself? For me kindness when I'm feeling something that is hurting could be as simple as placing my hand on that part of the body. To me, that is a self compassionate act is offering myself touch. It could be giving myself the space to like, acknowledge that that is real for me, rather than gaslit my own feelings.
Casey: That's the kind thing [00:09:00] what I'm about to share. In how you can like prepare for some hard conversations. I think that these next steps that I'm about to share also what it would mean to choose, to be kind. So first I think compassion is a number one practice to adopt, to make. Easier. That's so funny to say, to make it easier, easier to have hard conversations, hard conversations are not easier.
Casey: And when you're being compassionate, I think they can become easier. So practice compassion is my first point or first tip. The second point or tip is to prepare for the conversation and. You know, I fully trust that you have your own wisdom inside around what you need to feel prepared for hard conversations, and I'm sharing a few different options in case they might [00:10:00] help.
Casey: So notice what resonates with you for me when I know that there's a hard conversation I need to have, I'm navigating. Boundary stuff right now, like setting a boundary and that's hard. That's hard to set boundaries. Like, I don't know. I was going to say nobody likes setting boundaries, but maybe some people do.
and it's hard. So when it comes to me preparing to set a boundary, I need to tune into myself and ask myself, what is my need or desire here. Like truly what is my need or desire? And there are a number of different ways that. May access that need or desire one way that I access a need or discover what I need is through practicing the body acronym, exercise attuning to my body, tuning into sensation in my body.
Casey: Feeling it, [00:11:00] even if it's uncomfortable and having a presence with it, to understand what it is, it's illuminating about what I need. So the body acronym exercise, I have an audio recording that you can use that you can find out, let your body lead.com. If you've never practiced the body acronym exercise before.
Casey: And if this is your first time here, B stands for breathe. Oh, stands for observe. Observe the sensations in your body D is delayed. Don't fix it, feel it, and why is say yes. So it is a embodied practice that can help you determine what it is that you need and what it is that you desire. It's important for you to get clear on what your need is.
Casey: I think as part of prep, preparing for a hard conversation, another way you might get clear on what your need or desire is, is to journal. right. And maybe even write about what your intended outcome is as it relates to the hard conversation. [00:12:00] I recently was listening to another podcast episode. I'm trying to remember which one it was.
Casey: I think it was, we can do hard things, Glennon, Doyle, and they were interviewing a stair Parral who is a quite famous, I would say relationships guide. And one of the practices that she suggested. As it relates to navigating relationships is actually writing a letter to that person, the person that you want to communicate with, whether or not you send the letter, the point is not to send the letter, but just imagining that that person is in front of you, even if you haven't spoken to them for years, imagining that they're in front of you and writing a letter to them as if they're there can allow you to process some of the feelings and emotions and.
Casey: Almost like excavate your own truth through that process. So I think that could really help you understand or get clear on what it is that you need or desire as part of your preparation for [00:13:00] the conversation. Another part of preparation that I think is worth asking is what will help you feel safe? So here's the thing when we don't feel safe.
Casey: In our bodies and nervous systems, it's really hard to have conscious conversations. And what I mean by that is conversations from a like responsive place rather than a reactive, space where you're booted into a stress response. So safety. We often talk about as it relates to trauma informed work and, the nervous system safety is critical for having intentional, thoughtful, conscious conversation.
Casey: So what will help you feel safe? Honestly, part of what might help you feel safer in a conversation is to [00:14:00] have a little note card that has your bulleted points on it that might help you feel like you'll remember why you're there, what your needs are, what you want to communicate versus just remembering it, especially, especially in the context of a conversation that you're scared to have.
Casey: You know, having that as an anchor can be supportive, that might be one of your ways that you feel more safe. Another thing that might help you feel more safe is actually requesting a certain environment to have that conversation within. It's amazing how much our environments affect us. And I am talking about like physical environment.
Casey: As well as like mode of communication, you know, there might be a certain level of safety that you feel by communicating via text versus via phone versus in-person and also like in public, versus in private. So thinking [00:15:00] about what environment helps you to feel more safe is really supportive for a meaningful conversation to have.
Casey: What else would help you feel more safe? Maybe you need to have a text message exchange, setting up the intention of the conversation before the conversation actually happens. That might be part of what helps you feel safe. You might feel more safe by telling a friend that you're about to have a hard conversation and knowing that with whatever happens, you can go back to that friend after.
Casey: Process, whatever, whatever that was, you know, there's a lot of different ways that you could create safety ahead of time in order to feel like you're able to leap into having that hard conversation. And then the last part of this preparation, I think that can be really, really helpful that I've [00:16:00] really just attuned to within the last year.
Casey: Really answering the question, how can you manage your energy? And so these are like energetic practices that can support you, staying centered or more centered when you're about to enter into a conversation that could dysregulate you or trigger you. So here are three different energy practices that you could do in preparation for a hard conversation.
Casey: Again. You know, bring to mind what, what hard conversation you're avoiding, you know, could be connecting with your partner about your needs, not being that or asking for help because of mental illness, it could be anything. So these three energy practices I think could really. One of them is a grounding practice.
Casey: And what this looks like is I like to do it standing. I like to stand tall and [00:17:00] deepen my breath. And as I exhale, imagine. Tree roots growing down through my feet and with each exhale, it's like they extend deeper and deeper into the earth and I'll stand there for, you know, if I have one minute, one minute, two minutes, five minutes, 10 minutes, and just breathe and visualize these roots.
Casey: Growing down into the earth, down, down, down, extending outward, creating this foundation of stability. It's hard for me to lean into uncomfortable situations. If I don't feel grounded, if I feel like I'm not embodied and not supported. And so this energetic practice of growing tree roots and really using that to help shift my energy can be really supportive as preparation for a hard conversation.
Casey: Managing your energy. Another thing that I learned recently is [00:18:00] how to protect my energy. And I use a practice that I learned from my healer called a white light shield. And I just offer this up in case it resonates where again, I'll be standing. I'll inhale and imagine white light coming in through the crown of my head.
Casey: And as I exhale, I imagine sending that white light down through my feet, into the earth, deep into the earth. As I inhale, I imagine drawing that white light energy up just below my feet. And then I'll exhale like this. And as I do, I imagine that white light extending outward a boat of, you know, like three foot perimeter around me.
Casey: And then I'll inhale that white light up like a cylinder all the way up above my head. And I'll exhale again to expand it out six feet [00:19:00] in diameter. And then I'll take one more breath and imagine that white light encompassing. And I asked for that light to be like set in place for it, to be a protective energy, to support me in staying in my center and sort of keeping out what isn't mine, take it or leave it, try it on for yourself.
Casey: And the third energy practice that I started to do that really works for me is again, a preparation practice. Where I close my eyes and I visualize that person, the person, I need to have a conversation with the person that triggers me, the person who disregulates me, the person I, have maybe strong feelings toward, and I will surround them in white light.
Casey: And remember that they too are divine and I will imagine and visualize that person and [00:20:00] practice having. A conversation with them almost like I'm having a conversation with their higher self. So I close my eyes. I imagine them. I talk to their higher self. This all happens before an actual conversation happens.
Casey: And, you know, this is how this has played out for me recently. There's, there's someone that's very close to me in my life who struggles with addiction and they. Called me unexpectedly one day. And I saw, I saw the name on my phone and I wasn't prepared. And so I couldn't answer it and expect myself to have a calm and grounded conversation.
Casey: So I didn't answer it in that moment. I, sent a text response and set up a time. Outside of that moment. So that's what I needed to feel safe. And then I did my energy work. I set up my [00:21:00] like tree roots, my white light shield. I visualize that person. I imagine myself talking to their higher self. And then at a later point in time, I called and was able to have that conversation from a more thoughtful and grounded place.
it's just an offering. Try it out and see what works for you. Finally, honestly, one of the most, I think, important coaching skills that can be really helpful for hard conversations is the skill of acknowledging and validating someone's feelings and experiences. Let me explain what this sounds like, what this looks like, what that means acknowledging and validating requires that you believe.
Casey: And understand that exactly what someone thinks feels does. It has everything to do. Every [00:22:00] little thing that they've experienced leading up to that point. And so in many ways, a person's thoughts, feelings, beliefs, systems, actions always is completely valid given their life experience trauma, et cetera, context environment, who they surround themselves with.
Casey: And so if that's true, then anything that that person feels is also completely valid given their circumstances. Now, this might be a hard thing to wrap your mind around, especially if, especially if you're feeling hurt right now and defensive and your ego is armoring up your heart. It might be hard to imagine this person that you need to have a conversation with.
Casey: It might be hard to imagine that. They're way their belief system is valid, especially if you disagree with it, right? Like we're experiencing this right now, this like right wrong, you know, [00:23:00] it feels almost impossible for some people to imagine how another might feel a certain way. And there's a good reason why even if you don't necessarily agree with that reason, there is a reason why.
Casey: Anyone in any given moment with any given belief system experiences life from that lens. And so if that's true, then acknowledging and validating someone's feelings is showing a level of understanding for their truth. No matter what. Now that doesn't mean you have to agree with them. And when you learn the skills of acknowledging and validating, you help people remove their armor, you create a space for conscious conversation to actually exist.
Casey: Here's what this sounds like. [00:24:00] Okay. Let me think of one of these examples.
oh God, I'm gonna, I'm going to go there. I'm going to talk about vaccines. Here's what this sounds like. If you are acknowledging and validating someone who has chosen to be vaccinated, of course, you've chosen to be vaccinated. Given your trust in science. And your desire to be protected from a virus that has impacted you so deeply and immensely.
Casey: And especially that you have, especially because you have small children that you want to protect, anyone in your shoes would get vaccinate. Right. So I'm acknowledging their choice and their truth and expressing that it makes perfect sense that that choice would be one that they would [00:25:00] make given the circumstances in their life.
Casey: Here's what acknowledging and validating someone who's chosen not to get vaccinated might sound like. Of course you've chosen not to get vaccinated, given that you feel. Completely distrustful of all of the misinformation or the back and forth information or the, inconsistent information that you've been experiencing.
Casey: And also because your intuition is saying no, anyone in your shoes would make that choice. It makes perfect sense. You would now. I'm not saying one is right or one is wrong and it doesn't even matter. Like what I agree with or don't agree with. I'm just giving you an example of what acknowledging and validating someone's feelings and experiences sounds like.
Casey: And again, here's the [00:26:00] formula. Of course you feel blank given blank, anyone in your shoes would feel that same way. It's acknowledging that. If someone feels something, there's a reason why, and they're not alone or crazy for feeling it, this is a way that we stop gaslighting other people's feelings. Now I can disagree and acknowledge and validate someone.
Casey: It's kind of like apologizing, you know? Maybe I didn't intend to hurt anyone. My intentions were good, but then someone is telling me that I hurt them. Of course, I'm going to apologize, even if it wasn't my intention to hurt them. I'm sorry for hurting you. I'm sorry for insulting. You. I'm so sorry. It takes a level of like [00:27:00] dropping the.
Casey: To be able to acknowledge and validate someone, especially if they disagree with you now, to a certain extent, it takes two to tango. Like these conversations are hard and you can only be responsible for your side of the street. And these practices and skills will help you to feel. Of how you're going about these conversations.
Casey: So, so far we talked about practicing compassion, preparing for the conversation, and part of preparation is getting clear on what's your need or desire. What will help you feel safe? How can you manage your energy? And then I offered you a coaching tool that can help to disarm another person. So that there's more of an [00:28:00] openness and an open-heartedness for the conversation now, no promises, right?
Casey: Like. Sometimes these things don't work and we're all human and we fuck things up and it's like, Ugh, you know, or we act out of alignment or we get agitated and triggered and lash out from a fight flight space. Like that is only human and. What I'm hearing from the people in my life, the friends, the family members that are struggling with hard conversations is that they want to be able to do have these conversations thoughtfully because they want, they want to be reconnected.
Casey: They want a sense of belonging. There's like a desire or a need or a longing that is part of this challenge, I guess. And I guess the final piece that I'll share. Is around embodying courage, you know, courage is feeling the [00:29:00] fear and doing it anyway. Embodying courage means to be able to hold space for yourself and the discomfort that you feel inside of yourself, the nervousness, the anxiety, the, the like sweaty palms, perhaps, and leaning in any way.
I'm thinking about, I think it's Amy Cuddy, who did the Ted talk on power poses. And I don't know why that's coming through right now, but maybe part of your practice of embodying courage is standing in front of mirror in front of a mirror and putting your hands on your hips and staying connected to center.
Casey: Or if you want to like stay open-hearted, it's maybe placing your hand on your heart and taking a few deep breaths. Like how can you embody? Correct. And lean into the discomfort and have that conversation. I hope that was helpful. If there was even one little bit of wisdom or tips that helped you, I would love to [00:30:00] hear about it.
Casey: Reach out to me. Email is best [email protected]. and if you have other questions or topics that you'd love for us to cover on this podcast, please feel free to. Again, this is the kickoff for the worthy and well loved series. I wasn't necessarily planning for this topic to be the first episode of this series.
Casey: And it's just been so prominent in the last few days that it felt like it was a necessary, necessary one to speak to. And if you've had. practices or things that have really worked for you for approaching hard conversations. I want to hear about that too. I hope you have an incredible, incredible day.
Casey: Happy December. Oh my gosh. We're already into December and I can't wait. You can't wait for you to hear some of the upcoming episodes that we have planned. All right. Take really, really good care. And I can't wait to chat with [00:31:00] you soon. Bye bye.
